aka 008

Bureaucrat Admin
  • I live in Another Timeline
  • I am Female
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  • A couple of small things:

    1. Do you have any thoughts on the Hawkins tunnel system article? Generally, I think it's in a good place, but the main thing which bothers me is the "spore-spray". I've looked around online for interviews which could provide a better name for this thing, but I've had no luck yet. Do you think it needs to be changed? I've seen a few articles where it's described as a gland, or a valve. But nothing from official sources.

    2. I played around with the UD Navbox, and I thought it would be fun if that particular Navbox had a color scheme to match the Upside Down. I'm thinking, probably different shades of blue. While you certainly want visual consistency across a website, you also want little bits and pieces that catch your eye and break things up a bit, if you get what I mean. As long as they don't appear totally out-of-place.

    However, as I quickly realised, this would probably mean creating new templates, documentation etc, which I am proficient, yet not amazing, at doing. Do you think this idea would be more effort than it's worth?

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    • 1. It's coming along nicely. The only thing I can think to add at the moment is some behind the scenes information. As for the spore-spray, while I was doing some research, I came across the term "sporangium", which is "a receptacle in which asexual spores are formed." While we not not know the exact nature of the spores, and while not referred to as such officially, I think the term would be the most appropriate to use until they are ever given an actual name.

      2. I actually think giving the navboxes different color schemes is a great idea. The problem, though, is since we are using the Lua navbox, I believe the only way to change the color of certain things (such as the navbox header) would require the use of CSS. Luckily, there is an alternative: as I was looking for navbox templates, I found one that allowed for customization without the use of CSS, as well as being fairly simple to put together like the Lua navboxes. You can find this template here, while an example of the navbox (albeit with no color tweaks) can be seen here. As you can see, the simple navbox doesn't look exactly like the Lua ones, but perhaps with a little more tweaking we can get close.

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    • 1. Yeah, I think there are a few BTS bits and pieces from the after-show about the tunnels. 

      Sporangium, what a funny word. I’m kind of torn on it, since I really like it, but I’m not completely sold on it. I used ‘spore-spray’ because it was the most literal description I could think of; this is the same reasoning behind the name of the old “Slug-like creatures” page. If things aren’t given official names, then I prefer to give them neutral, straight-forward labels which rely little on assumptions and individual interpretation. So I guess what I’m trying to say is, I’m not sure if ‘sporangium’ is neutral enough. Although the definition is pretty close what we see on-screen. Hmm.

      I’m also not sure about “sporangium” because of the definition, or at least the one you found: "a receptacle in which asexual spores are formed." This would be assuming that the spores are indeed formed inside it. It would also be assuming that spores have a reproductive function (just basing this off the ‘non-sexual spores’ part). While I think these are fairly safe assumptions, they are still assumptions. Then again, maybe this is just excessive nit-picking by me. Also, do sporangia spray out their spores in a similar way to what happens on the show? I do hope an interview or some concept art will come out and shed some light on this. To be honest, this really isn’t a huge issue, so I think ‘spore-spray’ and ‘sporangium’ both work for now.

      2. Alright, I’ll play around with that alternative when I get the chance. Still, it might be worth looking into the CSS option, it might be easier to pull off than expected. I guess it is a question of whether it would be easier to work with the Lua navbox or to tweak the customizable version.

      I saw that you brought up the subject of page length. I don’t know why you removed it, but I agree with you. The Eleven article does need some work, or it is going to become unwieldly. I agree that the Powers and Abilities section should become its own article. The main article only really needs a few paragraphs summarising her powers, and a link to the dedicated page. I also think that her History section needs some major reworking. It’s by far the longest section, and while I haven’t read through it in a while, I’m willing to bet that there’s much in there that can be trimmed down.

      As for the Influences article, I think that it should be spliced in two as with the Minor Characters article: one article for Season One, and another for Season Two. It’s true that even a Season One Influences article would still be fairly lengthy; however, I doubt there is much more to be added to that list anyway. Going forward, creating an Influences page for each season is probably the most sensible and sustainable option.

      I like the tabs, though if we did add them, we need to make sure there are alternative links available for mobile users.

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    • 1. I can see where you're coming from, but a lot of things in the show are based off of assumptions. Granted, they are made with substantial evidence (like the Demogorgon being attracted to blood), but they are still assumptions made by the characters in order to best understand what they are up against. There is also the issue of, since the biological growth of the Upside Down is more-or-less alien (meaning unfamiliar, not necessarily from outer space), that there could be parts of it that function in a way that there is no direct earthly counterpart. So we may essentially have to do what the characters do, and do our best to understand things with what we know.

      On the definition I provided, that is one that I pulled directly from google. While the google definition feature is handy, I'm afraid it also has a habit of sometimes over-simplifying definitions. The wikipedia article explains it a lot better: "A sporangium is an enclosure in which spores are formed. It can be composed of a single cell or can be multicellular. All plants, fungi, and many other lineages form sporangia at some point in their life cycle."

      When I was doing research, I also came across the term "basidium", which not only also produces spores, but actually forcibly discharges them, in a similar fashion to the growths in the tunnels. The reason why I don't believe that we should use this specific term, however, is because basidia seem to only be present in a certain division of fungi. Also, if I'm understanding correctly, I believe "sporangium" might be a blanket term, and a "basidium" is one of several types sporangia. I'm not an expert on plants/fungi, so I could be completely wrong, though. In any case, even if sporangium isn't the best term, I also believe "spore-spray" is an acceptable stand-in.

      2. Alright, let me know which you think we should do once you're done testing things out.

      Well, the reason I removed the part about article length is because I felt I was getting too ahead of myself, haha. I thought it would be best to wait until it's closer to season 3's release and then see if we have found any alternate solutions. Nonetheless, I'm glad you agree. Though, this is definitely an issue that needs to be discussed with the other admins since it would be a rather drastic change. In the meantime, I guess I could start looking into how to create the tabs, just in case we all come to an agreement.

      Alright, I'll start working on those articles as soon as I'm able to. Also, I really like the way you divided Eleven's History section. It's a lot easier to read than continuous giant walls of text. Another thing I've been thinking about, should we find a way to incorporate the family trees into the Relationships section?

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    • I think if we did use 'sporangium', we'd also need to explain what a sporangium is, or at least link to an explanation. Something like this: "The Mind Flayer had control over a strange, flower-like orifice embedded into one of the tunnel walls, which had a function akin to a sporangium " Otherwise, users might get confused by the term.

      Yeah, I decided to shift from Seasons to years, and then divide it up further into those sub-sections. I still think that the History section should be trimmed down a bit, but yeah, even just adding those sub-headings really helps you to digest all the information.

      If we were to do that, I would probably put the family trees at the top of the Familial subsection.

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • Why is the page for Billy's Pedal to the Medal playlist being deleted? It's been deleted twice with no explanation I can see.

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    • Because I feel that the character playlists aren't significant enough to have their own articles. Maybe they can be mentioned in a character's trivia section and in the "Marketing" section on Season Two page, but for every playlist to have its own article is excessive and unnecessary. 

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • Before we get any further into updating the wiki, I thought it would be nice to take a moment and share our thoughts on Season 2. It was something that we'd been waiting on for a long, long time, it would almost be a little weird not to.

    Season 2 is an interesting mixture of things. Season 1 was nostalgiac about 80s cinema, but Season 2 also incorporates nostalgia for Season 1. I thought at points, it felt perhaps a little too self-aware. Thankfully, that mostly dies off as the season progresses.

    I thought that, generally, the season did a good job at developing the returning characters. Steve, Dustin, Lucas, Will, Hopper and Joyce were especially great; they all got fleshed out, in one way or another. There were a few characters that did feel a little underdeveloped though, especially Jonathan and the Wheeler family in general.

    I have mixed feelings on Eleven's story. It had a great start: I loved the flashback to Eleven escaping the Upside Down (though it would have been cool if she had spent a little more time there). And I liked the dynamic between her and Hopper. However, the whole Terry Ives plotline felt a little unnecessary. I appreciate what they were going for with episode eight, but it did feel very clunky and out of place. The reunion with Mike was good, although I think it could've been a little earlier. Hopefully Season 3 can be a little more consistent in regards to her. The adoption is a good start.

    I liked most of the new characters. Dr Owens was surprisingly complex and well-written, while Bob was just a really likeable guy. Max and Murray were solid, although they didn't always add that much to the story. Neither Billy nor Kali were awful, but they did end up being slightly disappointing, especially since they had such impressive entrances. Hopefully they will be fleshed out next season.

    Perhaps my favorite aspect was the development of the Upside Down. The Mind Flayer and the Demo-dogs were a very worthy follow-up to the original Demogorgon. I was happy that they didn't answer too many questions, and left things somewhat mysterious. Very curious about the future of the Upside Down. The visuals, music and action sequences were also a cut above Season 1. 

    Overall, it wasn't as coherent as Season 1, but just as enjoyable, and delivered some of the best episodes of the show yet. 

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    • (Apologies for the really late reply. I had typed out my reponse but it didn't post, so I had to type it out again.)

      I loved the story this season. I love movies where characters have to survive and outsmart a hoard of creatues (Jurassic Park, Tremors, Attack the Block). The demodogs were fun additions and the scene with Will being possessed was phenomenal. Though, I kind of wish the threat was a little more widepsread this season. From the initial teaser trailer, and Gremlins being an inspiration, I was under the impression all of Hawkins would be affected. While that did happen somewhat with the pumpkins and tunnel system, for the most part the threat was still contained mostly to the lab and the Byers' house. 

      I really like the character development for some of the characters. Seeing more of Dustin's and Lucas's famlies and homes was great. It was also great to see more a Will, even if he wasn't completely himself. Seeing how much Eleven has learned being away from the lab for a year, and seeing her express a wider range of emotions was also great. However, I was kind of disappointed with Nancy and Jonathan, whose characters are almost stagnant.

      The new characters were really enjoyable. I remember going in ready to hate Owens, but by the end I really liked him. Bob Newby was also great. I'm glad Will had a positive father figure in his life, even if it wasn't for very long. Max was a great addition to the kids, and while I was never a fan of love triangles, I really like how the one between her, Lucas, and Dustin was handled. Sure, there was some competition between Lucas and Dustin, but it never got to the point where it strained their friendship. Luckily, it appears that love triangle was only a one season thing. 

      I kind of wish we got to see more of Murray Bauman. Just when I was really getting into his character, he stopped appearing. One thing that completely rubbed me the wrong way was Billy's interaction with Karen. I'm hoping and praying that scene was simply to show the "captivating" side of Billy's character and not alluding to anything in season 3.

      The soundtrack for this season was amazing, but it feels like they opted for using classic '80s music than an original score. Sometimes the music can be fun, but other times it can be distracting and can even pull emotion from a scene.

      Now, on to the subject of Eleven's backstory. I feel like it should have been handled differently. Not omitted, but maybe more dispersed across seasons. Like, Eleven discovered her mother this season, and then found Kali the next season, or vice versa.

      As for the entirety of episode 7, I personally don't have many problems with it, and even enjoyed it, but I can definitely see where the backlash is coming from. Having a stand alone episode in a show that's supposed to be an 8 hour movie is not the best idea. That's why I originally assumed it would be episode 9, that way it would function as a giant epilogue of sorts. When it was revealed to be 7, I was worried it would ruin the flow of the show, and my suspicions were correct.

      I know from all I've written it seems like I didnt like the season that much, but I assure you I really enjoyed it. While I'm not a fan of all the decisions they made, I did like where they took the main story and expanded the world they created. I will fully admit that some of the problems I had are from my own personal opinions and expectations. While I can't say I liked it more than the first, I will say it made me excited for the third. The possibility of Brenner still being alive? The Mind Flayer watching over them? Kali, another Hawkins Lab test subject with abilities, is still out there? Eleven finally getting to live a normal life? Is there a release date yet???

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    • I see what you mean. It did sound as if the Upside Down would threaten all of Hawkins. Nevertheless I was impressed by the increased scale of the threat, from the Mind Flayer to the root tunnels, from the Demodogs to that gargantuan Gate. I think the Duffers are doing the right thing by incrementally raising the stakes, from season to season. We probably won't even witness the full wrath of the Mind Flayer until the final season, assuming he is indeed the series's main villain. 

      Nancy, Jonathan and their relationship were definitely underdeveloped. They got off to a good start in the first few episodes, but then it got stilted. Jonathan was especially disappointing. At least Nancy had that whole Justice for Barb storyline going on, as well as the cute Snow Ball moment. Jonathan didn't really have anything else to do besides hooking up with Nancy. With Mike, it makes sense that he would have a reduced role, after what happened with Eleven. There was no such reason for Jonathan. 

      Is it bad that I actually loved the scene with Billy and Karen...? It felt so messed up, but in a really fun kind of way. I don't think anything would realistically happen between them, that would be a step too far for sure. I think the aim of the scene was to highlight how laughably stale Karen and Ted's relationship has become. 

      Yeah, I think the show was rushing to establish Eleven's relationship with Terry and Kali. Maybe it will pay off in future seasons. But I think Eleven's story in Season 2 would have been more enjoyable if it focused on her relationships with Hopper and the other kids. Maybe Terry or Kali would still play a role, but not both of them. 

      At first I was slightly underwhelmed by the apparent lack of obvious set-up for Season 3, beside the Mind Flayer tease at the end. But after thinking over it, I realised there were a ton of possibilities that this season has created, there were a lot of subtle set-ups. 

      The confrontation between Max and Billy has surprising implications, if you think about it. The way that Max violently dealt with Billy was perhaps the most chilling moment of the season. Is she getting dragged into Billy's awful cycle of abuse with his father? Plus, Max uses the same needle which was being used on the possessed Will, which probably can't be a good thing.

      The idea of Brenner and other test subjects being out there is definitely intriguing. There's also that fragment of the Mind Flayer that leaves Will, we never see what happens to it. Could that be out there too? And will Terry ever wake up? Could we see a mother-daughter team-up against Brenner?! The ideas just go on and on - will Eleven and Max become buddies? (I wanna see Eleven on a skateboard!) Can the Wheeler family survive another year without collapsing? How are Will and Eleven going to interact, considering their shared connection to the Upside Down? Will Hopper and Joyce get together? And will we ever learn the fate of Yurtle the turtle? Questions, questions, questions...

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    • Good point. I guess I was just expecting more mass mayhem and widespread panic. Thinking it over, it's probably best that they slowly build up the threat, since there's still 2-3 seasons to go.

      I guess that's one way to look at the Billy and Karen scene, and it definitely makes sense in the context of this season being darker. But just don't think I'll ever be ok with it. I am glad that Karen is starting to treat herself, though. Like, Ted is not the best husband and now her kids are off fighting secret government organizations and interdimensional creatures behind her back. She definitely deserves more bubble baths.

      Yeah, I agree. It would have been more interesting to see her tackling with trying to be a "normal" kid after spending the first 12 years of her life in the lab, and her growing relationship with Hopper. But I guess that's what season 3 could be for.

      I can definitely see Kali coming back into the equation, maybe as an antagonist or even becoming an unlikely hero after getting a redemtion arc. What I want to know is the role Terry Ives will play in future seasons. It would be really strange for there to be no mention of her ever again, especially after the emotional reunion with Eleven. 

      I really don't think Max would allow herself to become abusive like Billy and her stepfather. Max did what she did because Billy was violently beating Steve, potentially to death. While her actions may have not been ethical, or completely justifiable, they did come from defending her friends and self defense. The look they shared before the Snow Ball could have been to establish to the audience that Max no longer has to deal with Billy's abuse, or at least not as much as before. (Of couse, this is mostly coming from speculation and my own opinions, so I could be completely wrong, but I have faith in Max.) The syringe issue is also interesting. Perhaps this could be foreshadowing to Billy's threat status being promoted to a much bigger threat level next season? Maybe the Mind Flayer's next host? 

      Yeah, the Duffers stated they intentionally made the season wrap up more neatly so they can start the next with more of a clean state. They also hinted that the Mind Flayer may have an interest in Eleven and her powers. With this knowledge, and all the unresolved plot threads from this season, there is plenty to speculate on how the next season will go down. 

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    • A FANDOM user
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    Hey there, I'm trying to set up a Discord chat sever and I'd love for you to join so we can start working on it! The link above will automatically send you to it.

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  • Hiya 008,

    I'm looking at the various issues/things that need to be addressed as Season 2 approaches, and I'm making a short list. After I've sent that, let me know if there's anything else to be discussed.

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    • View all 7 replies
    • You might have noticed, I've uploaded a new version of the Welcome image, one which is much less bulky. The "upside down" imagery is pretty self-explanatory, but out of curiousity, I've also made a flipped version.

      Stranger Things Wiki - Welcome refined flipped

      I personally prefer the original version, though I wonder if this flipped, more straight-forward version might be preferred amongst Wiki readers. Would appreciate your opinion on this, have been wondering about this for a little while. 

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    • I like it, makes the front page look less cramped. I honestly don't have a preference between the original or the flipped version. Though, if I had to choose, probably the original since it ties in the Upside Down theme of the wiki.

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • You’ve probably noticed that FANDOM has added videos to some of the more popular character pages on the wiki. I’m not sure really what to think about them. In some ways they are welcome in that they seem to be increasing traffic and views across the wiki, and they work as decent character summaries. However, as with the trailer on the Season 2 article, I find the sheer size of the window as well as the autoplay to be extremely grating. I am a little frustrated that FANDOM has once again gone ahead and done this without mentioning it to us first. We could try talking to them, but I think it’s unlikely they will make alterations. 

    Also, as we’re getting closer to the release of Season 2, there are a few things which need to be addressed. A while back, I made a ‘Locked’ template, a variant of the ‘Protected’ template. The idea is that certain pages could be ‘locked’ if need be, but trusted users on a shortlist could still edit those pages. However, the problem is that the only way I can see of doing this is temporarily making these users content managers, which is not ideal. Personally, I don’t plan on binging Season 2, so I won’t be able to answer edit requests in the immediate release period for fear of being spoiled. This might mean that there will be a strain upon the wiki during this time.

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    • Yeah, I've noticed. I have mixed feelings about them, pretty much for all the reasons you've listed.  The videos are apparently part of FANDOM's project of wiki moderniztion and are specifically added to reduce the number of ads on pages. The videos' purpose is understandable, since ads are one of the main reasons they make money, but what isn't understandable is how they have decided to make them so inconvenient for users. There's not even an option to hide/collapse the video. It is indeed very frustrating, especially since they don't seem to be interested in user feedback. 

      Well, we could semi-protect the pages, meaning unregistered users and users whose accounts are less than 4 days old won't be able to edit the pages. It's not ideal, but it's the closest option to what you had in mind and would probably help stop low quality edits, even if only temporarily. We also can't fully protect most of/all the pages since that is against FANDOM's terms of use. It's honestly surprising there's no feature that allows admins to create a list of trusted users that can edit protected pages. A feature like that would be very useful. 

      As for me, I'll be binging the series (though not all at once, maybe the first half one day, second half the next day) so until I've finished the season I will probably avoid the wiki as much as possible. I may drop by to make sure everything is still running smoothly, maybe undo vandalism, and making sure users are following the wiki's guidelines.

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • Not sure about the renaming of Sarah Hopper to Sara. I understand your reasoning behind it, but I'm not completely convinced. Everywhere I've seen her name, the spelling is inconsistent e.g. the subtitles, the track titled "After Sarah" from the Vol. 1 album. Hmm.

    Also, do you think the talk button might work again, if we reimplemented it? 

    edit: I just tried to reimplement the talk button, and it was still going haywire. Would be good to find the source of the problem

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    • Well, the way I see it, in these cases we have to take into account what source can be considered the "most official". In my opinion, those sources are the script and the episode credits (which, if I'm not mistaken, is the reason why the Monster's page is named "The Monster" and not "Demogorgon", though I do recall discussion to rename this page once more monsters are revealed, which I'm totally for).

      Sure, the captions are used on episodes, but they are sometimes slightly innacurate when it comes to character dialogue, and it is not far-fetched to assume that they can be wrong on other details. Not saying that we should never use the captions for information, but should probably consider all other sources of information before using them as a source. A good example is the Library Tendril. The tendril has not really been referred to by an actual name from any other official sources so far, so right now the captions are the most official source we've got.

      As for the name of the track "After Sarah", merchandise contains innacuracies all the time. It could simply be that the person who did the tracklisting simply put "Sarah" because that is the most common spelling of the name. Of course, we can never know for sure.

      However, if we can not reach a full agreement, we can always do what the One Piece Wiki does and put a note at the top of the article saying "The subject of this article is sometimes called 'Sarah/Sara'" or something like that.

      About the talk button, Ive tried several times to reimplement it, but everytime it has not worked. I don't know if it's something on the wiki, or has something to do with the source script, but I think the best thing to do would be to start a discussion on the the feature's talk page on the Open Source Wiki.

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    • I think a variant of the 'Unnamed' notice template could work nicely. Maybe saying: The title of the subject of this article has not been clarified. Any objections to the current title should be discussed either in the article comments or on the article's talk page. Something like that.

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    • Anyway, I think it's fine to just leave it as Sara for now.

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    • Alright, I'll start working on the template shortly. Hopefully in the future there'll be a more definite clarification about the spelling.

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • I was able to find more named uncredited extras from season one as well as a few bts pics of them in costume. Could you maybe find Jb Blaine, Colby John Davis, Stephen Dean, Richard Molina, Ryder Morlong, and Ryan Newton in the episodes, please?

    Here's a screencap site that might help you:

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    • A FANDOM user
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  • Could you maybe help me create a wikia based on Netflix's adaptation of A Series of Unfortunate Events, please?

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  • Hello, 008

    I am administrator on the Stranger Things wiki in Spanish, I am writing to ask you if you could add the interwiki link on the main page of the wiki, I already added you in mine.

    Greetings :D

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